Sir Alf 6:30 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Our issues are no doubt down partially to BFS tactics and team set up, roles etc.

But we also have too many players who are not comfortable enough on the ball throughout the team. Some of that is down to the legacy of the BFS squad that got us promoted and kept us in the Premiership. His blueprint is tall, strong, physical units rather than more mobile, technical types.

We cannot find the movement, pace and passing options to open up teams with passing and possession. Again today, we play it around in deeper positions and across the park but eventually have to resort to the direct ball as we are closed down. Watching even Villa today, they are able to play a passing game at speed with short interchanged passes. That is what BFS derides as "tippy tappy" football and while even the better teams use a direct ball at times they are abe to play to feet much better than us.

ChesterRd 6:29 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Whereas Allardyce's punting balls into the box was never anticipated? You can't just write off what went on as "being found out" The only thing being found out is Allardyce.

That group of starting players are far better than what they are showing. They are confused and demoralised, no wonder they are all playing shit for the most part.

stirlinghammer 6:28 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Valencia and sakho were getting the ball much quicker early on on the season. We were pushing teams back and causing problems with early crosses which sakho and Valencia were scoring from and they were both getting beyond full backs and central defenders, our midfield pushing up quickly too,

Iron2010 6:28 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Alex

We've hardly played the diamond since Christmas and when we have Nolan and noble been paired to lumber around in the middle.

We have reverted to 451 with the two wide players supporting the full backs !

Alex V 6:28 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Iron2010 6:24 Sun Apr 19

It's a mid-table squad, no question. But it's also weak enough to struggle at times at this level. See the form since Christmas as strong evidence.

stirlinghammer 6:24 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Downing was made out to be some sort of messi after 4/5 decent games. There is no way he should be given a free role next season and he certainly has done nothing as a winger either.

Iron2010 6:24 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

It depends on your expectations but the squad is more than strong enough to finish top 12 if you or I were managing it and that's before further top 6 type investment in the summer.

Alex V 6:24 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Alex V 6:20 Sun Apr 19
...who can feed him the ball to 'feet'...

claret on my shirt 6:23 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

£10m for Song you have to be kidding me, i'd rather give Poyet a go. Song has been complete dog shit since christmas.

Alex V 6:23 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

stomper 6:01 Sun Apr 19

I don't agree about shape being the issue. The diamond has been found out and we've looked just as awful playing it since christmas. It's too weak defensively imo - I think we're using the diamond as a bit of a emotional crutch when the reality is the players are just not performing well enough whatever the formation.

Alex V 6:20 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Norflundon 6:13 Sun Apr 19

Fair comment, but I don't share your view of Valencia or Downing. Downing was superb but only for a few games - I would describe 90% of his West Ham career as 'anonymous'. Valencia looks completely lost to me - needs to play in a possession team who can feed him the ball to feed under less pressure.

Of course it's the manager who seems happy for players to either not improve or get worse. Agree on all the criticisms of him.

Willtell 6:13 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

There is no way we will pay the going price for Song and Noble is more reliable in that role imo. Song is over-priced so unless he and Barcelona accept less then he won't be here next year.

The one thing I am sure of is that SA is holding this squad back by his only tactic of 4-5-1. It does not suit the squad we have.

Norflundon 6:13 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Alex
Or he's picked players out of their best positions and played them out of form....
Valencia has gone from playing well as part of a front 2 to being stuck out wide in a midfield 5
Downing who was superb at the point of the diamond got shunted out wide
Song who played so well alongside Kouyate in the middle of the diamond has been swapped with noble who was at the base this clearly doesn't suit him because when he does give the ball away its in areas that really hurt us
i think a forward thinking modern manager would of got far more out of this group of players....you only need to see his awful substitutions in last couple of months
I know it gets over used but he's an absolute dinosaur who has no place in modern football he's the managerial equivalent of sticking Vinny jones in the middle of your midfield

stirlinghammer 6:04 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Will...I would say song and kouyate will be motivated by a better manager. Noble is a bench warmer. No need for him to be in the team if form song is starting.

And downing is absolutely shit. Get in a creative player to replace him.

Far Cough 6:02 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Song was fucking shit today

stomper 6:01 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Is that really the case Alex? I think its a criticism that could apply to Song. Isn't the real problem that Sam changed a winning shape and played people out of position.
I don't know whether we got the same commentary in the States, but Tim Howard was saying that Song was our best player with only him and Noble trying to press the opposition.

theaxeman 5:56 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Alf

he changed the system to accommodate his cronies long before we were found out

v

the squad will improve next season so whats thr problem

Alex V 5:24 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

>>> IMO even a much better tactical and motivational manager than BFS will be limited by the current quality in the squad.

Strongly agree. That is my major concern going into the Summer and next season - that actually the players have been shown up in the second half of the season as having much less quality than we thought.

Willtell 5:24 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

For me playing 3 central midfielders who are all similar in style and a lone striker shows SA for the poor manager that he is. Yes we defended in depth but we have no decent shape and constantly get caught straight through the middle.

Valencia is a central striker played on the wing. Downing has shown his best as an attacking midfielder and gets played on the wing. Song is one defensive midfielder too many and Nolan is a waste of space. Where was Amalfitano and Nene and why are they worse than Nolan Jarvis? I just don't fucking get it!

I don't so much see a problem with our squad as with an intransigent manager fixated on a formation (4-5-1) that is not working for the team. 4-4-2 and the midfield diamond is what works. Sakho and Valencia ripped defences apart up until SA started fiddling it back to 4-5-1 to fit Nolan and Carroll in.

New manager with a tactical idea or two next please G&S?

Northern Sold 5:22 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

* elbows P in the temple *

Sir Alf 5:22 Sun Apr 19
Re: Man City v West Ham - Official Match Thread 2-0

Again only my opinion. but teams / opposing managers started to work out our new approach with use of overlapping wingers and the diamond etc.. This is especially the case with teams coming to UP. BFS has not helped in all this of course. He was too keen to get Carroll / Nolan partnership in place once we had a few injuries and the AFCON. That interrupted our momentum for sure but it is also that the opposing teams set up to counter what was working earlier on in the season.

We needed a more tactically dynamic manager but who ever is in charge will be limited, over a season, to some extent by our current squad.

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